Newbie Questions

Re: Infinite loop error coming up, and can't see how to find cause

warrtalon — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 06:55:40 GMT

If you don't know that all I want to do is help people, then there is nothing else to say. Good luck finding your solution with free help.

Re: Infinite loop error coming up, and can't see how to find cause

Ian Dawson — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 07:32:47 GMT

Thanks for the critical reply Warrtalon. When I make a post, I reread my posts and usually reconstruct them many times during the day.

You are a bit verbose!
I do not like paragraphs. I prefer itemised entries.
And I find it hard trying to work out what you are getting at. Are you offering help, or just criticism? I write what I did, trying to make you understand what I know. I think you do?
But I am just writing to may sure that is what we are talking about. And you know what I am up to.
Some people are very vague with their answers. Maybe I am, past replies have been to same back to me.

For your information W., my introduction to InfoPath --
I initially imported the form structure from a client notepad layout.
About a month after that I designed the Access DB.
I created a blank IP form, then imported the structure from a notepad form.
I have then tailored the InfoPath form using conditional formatting and rules, to format the fields, and/or hide fields.
Since then I have been adding to and redesigning the form, and trying to meet the clients needs.
I try to work through the form and its fields working out where problems lie.
The errors that are returned are not user friendly. What I mean is, they do not indicate which field is causing the infinite loop.
It knows, or thinks, there is a field with an infinite loop, but, does not show which field it is.

Many times I have generated a logic inspector output report. i find that useful.
It is easier to read than trying to test each control, and its internal workings.

Thanks heaps, for your help Patrick.

I know a little about the xml & xsd schema. They seem only a way to describe the same thing in different applications.
In the past, I have not seen any solutions coming from the xsd or xml files. Not that I find them of any use.

I am currently 3/4's of the way through the Logic Inspector, I have corrected a few rules. Added a few more rules.
But, still have not seen anything standing out as the cause of the infinite loop problem.

A month ago I was writing rules in a control that concatenated data onto the control itself.
For example something like, Inside fieldA rule ,
I had FieldA = concat(FieldA, " extra data appended", fieldb, " ", fieldf, ".")
And I would have following this rule, multiple other rules appending other data and field into the same field (fieldA).
Each rule would have different conditions.
That is I was appending data.

I thought that was the error.
So I had to create a series of fields, and use each consecutive field to gradually build the print line field, I wanted.
Yet the error is still appearing. vis infinite loop. I will continue examining the Logic inspector for the solution.

The goal of my project is, once everything is working,
the plan is to then export the MS Access print line fields into a word document,
then this will allow the client to edit the data berofre they publish it. That is hat they want.

Patrick, I will look into your recommendations.
However, I will complete perusing the L.Inspector for solutions first.

Thanks again Patrick.

If I get a chance I will continue to amend this form.

Re: Infinite loop error coming up, and can't see how to find cause

warrtalon — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 13:45:42 GMT

I wasn't suggesting you "waffle," but rather that you speak in a manner that is understandable by someone who hasn't just sprinted a mile and is short of breath. You say you state facts, but you don't. You just state what you think are facts but are not getting at the heart of the problem. If you think the issue at hand is not clouded by your out-of-breath ramblings, then either it's a cultural thing that everyone in your area speaks this way, or you aren't re-reading your posts, because they are like frantic horror movie scenes tied to an InfoPath problem. It's as if Count Dracula is chasing you while you're trying to fix InfoPath infinite loops.

You said that I am correct that rules are bound to data elements as if you understand what I mean, but then you go on to talk about Access data elements (maybe!) and needing to put a control on the canvas to change a rule (no!). Is your form template designed around the database schema of your Access DB? By that, I mean...when you created it iinitially, did you use the DB template type and tie directly to your Access DB's schema, or did you use a Blank form and then make a data connection to your DB? Do you not have a main data source with data elements you created yourself? Either way, your data souce pane on the right should show all your data elements, and when you double-click on them, you see Rules and Data Validation tabs. This is where such things live. They have nothing to do with controls on the form.

Data validation is not lacking - not sure where that came from. Rules cannot be used for data validation - they are not related. This is most likely what is causing your infinite loop - your comment that you rely on rules for data controlling?

Re: Infinite loop error coming up, and can't see how to find cause

Patrick Halstead — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 09:04:54 GMT

Hi Ian,

To remove the rules, you can Save the XSN as "Source Files". In InfoPath 2007, go to Files->Save as Source Files and create a folder to place the files. After you are done saving, close InfoPath and use Windows Explorer to navigate to the folder. Copy the manifest.xsf to manifest.xsf.bak so you have a backup. Right click the manifest.xsf and open in Notepad. Scroll down to the bottom of the file. You'll find that the rules are defined near the bottom. When you delete, be careful that you choose the correct start and stop for the rule. After you are done, save the XSF (ctrl-s) and close notepad. Right click the XSF and choose Design. Now you have the form open in the InfoPath designer and the rule(s) should be removed. If the form doesn't open, it means you didn't delete the rules in the XSF correctly.

Good luck!

Re: Infinite loop error coming up, and can't see how to find cause

Ian Dawson — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 08:26:50 GMT

THank youy for your reply,Warrtalon.

From what I can gather in your reply above, Data Validations is important for controlling the data. Well, I have previously looked at the Data Validation and found it a bit lacking.

So I rely on rules for data controlling. Data controlling for data manipulation behind the scenes.

I am not a verbose person, I try to avoid waffle.
And like to just state the facts.
Maybe, I should try to bind all the issues together by waffling, as you request. But, I feel that may cloud, or confuse the issue at hand.

You say, quite correctly, at last, that rules are bound to the data elements, In my case to MS Access data elements.
These links are stored within the InfoPath form. I quite agree with you.

If I want to destroy those rules, then how would I do that?
I can presume you load the field control onto the Form, change the binding or delete the rules within the field control. Is that correct.
My form is taking minutes to load up, and then to run. I gues the system is very confused. I have 18 infinite loop errors appearing.

Anyhow, Is the following correct,
If I go through the Logic inspector, I should see the problems there, and even obsolete control rules?
The logic inspector shows Default values, Buttons, and all defined variables, and their rules.
It does not show the conditional Formatting conditions.

Looking forward an early and helpful response.
Ian

Re: Infinite loop error coming up, and can't see how to find cause

warrtalon — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 00:48:33 GMT

Ian, I thought you already posted about this and found the answer when Jimmy helped you realize that it was a rule problem. Is that not the case? You keep talking about deleting views and controls, but those have NOTHING to do with rules. Rules are bound to the data elements themselves, not to the controls that display the data. You can delete every control on every view and still have all of the logic that you had when you started except for conditional formatting. Data Validation also is specific to the data element, so you have to work through the data souce to figure this stuff out, not the controls on the canvas.

Anyway, I said all this at the end of your other thread after you figured it out. How did you get back to this after saying you figured it out in the last thread. I'm confused.

I also can't figure out what you're frantically trying to say in fragments about default values and blank nodes. Please slow down, use a normal paragraph, and lay it out to us in a calm and concise manner. I believe this can be resolved if we communicate well.

Infinite loop error coming up, and can't see how to find cause

Ian Dawson — Wed, 01 Jul 2009 23:27:10 GMT

Hi,

I have an infinite looping error message appearing. And try as I can I cannot find the source ( or sources).

I have deleted all but one of the forms open in the Infopath file. And Have deleted all but 3 controls in that form. Yet the error persists to appear.

I and about to look through my logic inspector to see if it shows any irregularities.

So apart from above, Can you offer any suggestions?

As most fields (controls) are removed from the form, there are 2 that relate to each other, in as much as, one field concatenates the other fields value into its ouput in rules.
My second query here is, does it matter which order on the database the fields are created?
Eg The fields are - Print_line1 and print_line1b, they are created o the database in that order.
However, the values of print_line1b are used in print_line1.

Also, I have multiple rules in one control. Most of the rules assign values to the control, but the rules are independent of each other.
I thought this might have been the cause for this logs initial problem, weeks ago.

And finally, should I use the Default value in a control, I have been leaving it blank. And true values in the rules do not seem to work.
When I set a value into the Default value field, it does not have a compete value setting,. and refuses to disappear, when input values are blank???
Should I build a Rule to handle blank values???
I thought I tried this and it did not work. Can you offer any explanation?

Thanks,
Ian